Podcast: Holistic Birth Preparation with Guest, Aimee Strongman
Holistic Birth Preparation with Guest, Aimee Strongman
Season 2, Episode 8
The Mind, The Body, The Heart: 3 pillars of holistic birth preparation.
A way of approaching birth that you might not yet have considered. Taking a look how you can prepare yourself emotionally, spiritually and physically for birth; and how the three things are more closely interconnected than you first realise.
In this episode I am join by Pre and Postnatal yoga specialist and antenatal educator Aimee Strongman, who shares her insight into matresence, building self trust, physiological birth and power in the birth room.
Join us for an inspiring, gentle and reassuring conversation full of wisdom, learning and ideas to take forward into your birth!
TRANSCRIPT
AI GENERATED
I know right now you have no idea what to expect from birth, what it's going to feel like, how it's going to pan out.
And so what you thought was going to be this glowing experience of pregnancy has turned you into a bunch of nerves.
Well, you were in the right place because I am here to hold your hand as you prepare for the birth of your baby through the birth-ed online course.
The course that gives you the information you thought you were going to get from your antenatal appointments and didn't.
The birth-ed course opens your eyes to everything you need to navigate your pregnancy and birth choices so you can feel confident, informed and ready to take back control.
Available worldwide for just 40 pounds or $50.
Sign up now via the link in the show notes.
This episode of the birth-ed podcast is proud to be sponsored by Elvie, makers of Elvie Pump.
I bought and used the Elvie Pump after my second baby was born last year, and I couldn't recommend it enough.
I'll share a little more about my experience later in the show.
But if you'd like 15% off Elvie Pump, single and double, the smallest, quietest, smartest breast pump on the market, you can use the code BIRTHED between now and the 7th of September 2022.
This discount code is not available in conjunction with any other offer.
I'm Megan Rossiter from Birthed and you are listening to the Birthed podcast.
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Join me for some inspiring, informative, and often challenging conversations with the world's leading women's health experts, from midwives to obstetricians, duelers to activists, find yourself feeling more informed, more confident, and ready to take control as you embark upon this journey to parenthood.
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Ready to meet today's guest?
Hi everyone, welcome back to The birth-ed podcast.
Today, I am joined by the lovely Aimee Strongman, who is a yoga teacher specializing in pregnancy, birth preparation, biomechanics, and postnatal wellness.
She is the founder of Glow Yoga Studio and a mum of two boys, both born at home.
So Aimee, thank you so much for joining me.
Oh, Megan, it's such a pleasure.
Thank you for having me.
So today, we are going to be chatting about the three pillars of holistic birth preparation.
So when we think about birth preparation holistically, can you explain what are we talking about?
What are we looking at?
So for me, it's about including the whole being.
So holistically by nature, I think includes looking at sort of parts as they work together.
I think one of the dictionary definitions talk about intimately interconnected, which I just love because it means that you're taking into account the whole person, their makeup, what they've gone through in their life.
And we're looking at it from a kind of all-round perspective.
And I usually talk about it as the heart, body, mind or the head, the heart and the hearth, which is the kind of home, the kind of fire in your belly.
So really what you truly want and desire.
And so why is it helpful to break it down in this way?
Can you talk specifically about what we mean by the heart, what you mean by the body, what you mean by the mind?
Yeah, absolutely.
So, well, obviously, when we look with the head, let's start with that at the top.
It is really our mind and our mindset, our thoughts.
When we're looking at it in birth perspective, we're kind of, what do we think?
What are we told about birth?
I'm sure you hear from women and your clients, you know, there's so many stories that narratives that kind of interweave with what birth is all about.
But actually, do we know what we truly think?
What are our actual thoughts?
And so it's about preparing the mind.
And maybe in some instances, it's about shifting old thoughts and learning new things.
And I really, I remember one hypnobirthing course, one of my teachers just really blew my mind and made me watch a video about dolphins, kind of being around laboring women in Hawaii.
And yeah, it's quite out there and wild.
But for me, it was just like, oh, right, okay.
So it doesn't have to play out in a bed-like setting when I'm on my back, or it doesn't have to play out like I'm on my own frightened.
It was just a completely kind of change of perspective.
So I think that was, I think I saw that it was like a Channel 4 documentary or something like the woman, the woman at birth with dolphins or something.
Yeah, but there is, I mean, since then, I've been like, what is happening?
But there's lots of studies being done, you know, the, just the, you know, the animals coming to women in the oceans in Hawaii or a kind of way of, I don't know, a different form of hydrotherapy, a water birth to an extreme.
But it's just shifting your thinking of what do you truly know about, about birth?
What is it that you're, can you learn from across other cultures?
Can you kind of delve a bit deeper into the possibilities of what it can look like?
So that's why I kind of think about the head.
And also with the mindset element, it's really, yeah, it's how you feel, you know, wherever your mind leads, your body will follow.
But there's so much more research being done into this mind-body connection that I just think it's really important.
We don't just see birth as a physical experience, and we really see it as this kind of, yeah, holistic kind of process.
There's an incredible book.
I don't know if I can't remember who it's by, but it's called Cure.
Have you read it?
Oh, you would love it.
It's amazing.
It's about literally what physical changes happen in your body as a result of your mind and how it can even change things like your blood sugar levels and things like that, just through the way that your kind of brain is working.
So giving people, I think they had like placebo diabetes medication or something, and there were actual biological changes in the body, even if people knew what they were taking was a placebo.
So it's absolutely fascinating.
I would really recommend that book.
It's on the Amazon list.
That's amazing.
But it is, you know, I mean, through yoga, I know, you know, you can actually, you know, kind of biohack your breath, you know, in your nervous system, just by learning.
And you'll know that with hypnobirth and you just is there's power in it.
There's power in what you're thinking.
So, yeah, it's a big topic to delve into.
But that's the mind element.
Yeah.
The heart for me is very important just for my own experience of having my children, but also just knowing how powerful the intuition and the spirit actually can be during kind of labor and also into motherhood as well.
Really knowing that it's your intuition that is leading the way, that it's guiding you.
And it's that tiny little voice that whispers that you know that you should listen to, but you never do on most occasions.
And it's really tough.
It's really tough when we're just so busy and we're kind of going from A to B and we've got no time to read that and we're scrolling, scrolling, scrolling.
And it takes work and it takes time.
But it is vital, I think, in this kind of in this element of holistic birthing preparation, for sure.
That's probably, for most people, the bit that they just have like zero connection with, like that we've not even acknowledged really.
That we just don't see it as this, you know, for me, it's a rite of passage.
This is just like, you know, our first bleed, this comes next.
This is coming from maiden to mother into this new just realm of being that no one can prepare you for.
There's no guidebook or manual and you really are, you know, it can be very isolating, but it also can be very awakening.
And when you can tap into that heart that you say that we're really disconnected to and actually have lost that connection with over time, it builds up a wonderful trust with yourself and a wonderful ability to just to be you really, but be you with confidence.
And that's what I certainly found anyway, through my experience, it was real kind of sort of light bulb element.
Yeah, I like that phrase awakening that you use.
I think a lot of people find that either after the birth of their first baby or possibly kind of maybe their second, I think you sometimes see it more like you trust yourself more, maybe.
Recently, I had a course group, a cohort that were all by one were second time mums.
And that was really eye opening for me because sometimes I catch the first time mums who are kind of a bit more, you know, drawn to me in some form or shape or form.
But then this group was just all second time mums.
And, you know, we went round and we know what the story was going to be.
There was a couple of ladies who had a really positive home birth experience and wanted to re-ignite that for the second time.
But for the majority, you know, it was a very traumatic first experience and they wanted to do it a different way.
And that's why they were sort of seeking, you know, extra support.
But my thing is I want to get people in before the second time.
I want to get them before they get to that point where they have to redo it again.
I actually feel that women, if we start really connecting back to all these three, the heart, the body and the mind, actually, we can bypass that first initial really tough experience and see, you know, and have that in a knowing then for the next time and the subsequent birth thereafter.
Well, can we come on to the body in a second, because you've just sparked like a million questions in my head.
You already kind of mentioned that like the first bleed or kind of starting menstruation is that kind of that first transition, I suppose that we have as women in our lives going from child into sort of adulthood or the kind of change that we're that we face.
And do you know, do you think it goes back like this far?
Like I remember that being like this really secretive thing that happened.
It's not something that you really talked about.
And that in itself is this kind of big event.
And in other cultures, it is in some cultures, it's celebrated.
And in some cultures, it's sort of hidden even more than the kind of British culture that we come from.
And do you think that certainly for us, that's kind of where these thoughts that we have as women in terms of not engaging and disengaging with that heart part of ourselves?
Is that where it starts?
For sure.
I read an amazing book by Jane Hardwick Collins.
I'm sure you know and have talked about before in your podcast, but she is an Australian woman with, oh, a wise woman.
She, for me, I read her book and my whole kind of perception of birth changed, and it really kind of ignited what I'm doing now.
And she really sort of talks about the beginning and that men are this kind of initial first bleed in our menstruation is where it starts, is how we go into our womanhood, is how we approach what it means to be a woman and what it means to bleed every month and what it means to live by cycles and seasons.
And yeah, I mean, I feel very lucky.
I'm doing actually a bit of work on it in a minute, but I feel so grateful that I had such a wonderful experience.
I actually didn't start my period until I was 17.
So quite late on, but I didn't worry about that.
I had strong women around me just being really reassuring.
And then when it did arrive, it was a real sort of celebration.
And I felt I was able to talk to my father about it, who I lived with at the time.
So there was so much kind of, yeah, a wonderful kind of cocoon and actually it was fine.
And it kind of then carried on.
And I think there is a connection between that and birth and how we feel about our body and how we, yeah, learn to love it in all its wonderful kind of shapes and glory.
And my advice from my mother when I was growing up, when you have those teenage doubts of my body is changing, I'm looking curvaceous and I don't know how to kind of live in it and all those hormones that are traveling around.
And she was just like, you're a woman, you are forever changing.
You will always be changing.
And I really hung on to that.
I really, really believe that.
And I think it was just a great sort of body positivity message that kind of was shared.
I wouldn't say that's a sort of typical experience of kind of being like a teenage girl.
And there'll be people listening to everything you just said and sort of cringing and being like, oh, I still can't talk about it.
I still can't say the word vagina.
I still can't say the word vulva.
I still call it the wrong thing.
Like it's this hushed secret thing is womanhood, I suppose.
But what, I mean, it's crazy, isn't it?
When we think we all come from that place, we all come from women.
It's just, and I know I really, thinking about your listeners, I know that's the case.
I know it's sort of not normal.
It's not the normal occurrence.
And I think it should start being taught more in schools.
And I think young girls should be hearing it.
And young boys, I mean, I'm one to two boys.
I worry.
I want them to be understanding and aware of what happens in order for life to continue and to kind of keep circulating.
But it is hard and I'm not kind of, I don't want to dismiss anyone who feels, you know, the shame and the difficulty is hard.
You know, we're still going through this.
It's such a tricky subject to navigate.
What is womanhood?
What does it mean to be a woman?
What does it mean to bleed?
What does it mean to bear life and then nurture going forward?
It's big.
It's so much bigger than we actually give it credit for.
And that I think is, it's a huge, huge thing.
That's what it is.
It's this rite of passage.
It's not just this one-time event, which I think we get hung up on.
It's like, oh, I'm pregnant.
I won't tell everyone for three months, and then I'll try and learn as much as I can for the six months.
And then I'll just go with the flow, and then I'll have a baby, and then life will be just, you know, I'll just bounce back.
That is the message we're giving.
Life is going to be the same, but with a baby.
And people are coming out the other side completely transformed, like, oh my God, like who am I now?
And so when we're talking about this birth preparation, I think this is a kind of, it's just where it starts for a lot of people.
And then it's a journey that then continues for like a very, very forever probably after that.
So let's touch back ever so slightly.
We've talked about the mind, we've talked about the heart, and talking about the kind of the body to kind of connect the three together.
Yeah, of course.
So the body for me, I mean, it's where my passion lies with my love of yoga and my experience of yoga.
But also yoga is a unity, it's a yoking, it's what the Sanskrit word means.
It means to unite, come together.
And I think the body kind of ties in the heart and the mind, and then all three kind of work in unison.
But in pregnancy, you know, well, first of all, I think every woman needs to at least know what birth looks like physiologically, because we need to know what systems are in play.
We need to know what it looks like, I think, normally, what it, you know, if it was just left completely uninterrupted, undisturbed, you know, what happens, for us to then work out how to work with our bodies, to then make it an optimum or an optimal experience for both mother, for baby and, you know, for families all over really.
So I obviously say do yoga, but I think generally exercise and movement, you know, is key.
It also helps free up the body, you know, freeing up your mind, being a bit kind of, yeah, just loosening up, getting rid of any tension, which we need to do as labor approaches.
But it also builds strength.
It also builds really good connection to your pelvis, which is where I really focus all my yoga on, you know, this pelvic area that is harboring and kind of, yeah, holding baby in this wonderful hammock and cocoon of safety.
You know, it's doing a lot of work.
It needs to be loved.
It needs to be cared for.
And I know for not all, you know, not everyone is able to move.
I know, I know you, Megan, I've seen your stories and you're, you know, it's really tough when you're put in positions where it's just not possible.
But I think that's why it's wonderful.
When you work holistically, you're still working all elements.
You know, you can still, if you're not able to do so much movement, hopefully you can still work on the spirit and the mind.
And if you're, you know, you're not really feeling the heart, at least you can work maybe on the body and the mind too.
So you can definitely play around with it.
But the body and the biomechanics of birth for me, the possibilities when you understand how the body works, what birth can be like and how you can aid actually.
Just touching on the, for the people who, you know, I don't know, we've got pelvic girdle pain or like something that's like really kind of inhibiting their enthusiasm or ability to move.
The body, it does also just go back right, right, right to like surface level of just like being aware of what you're feeling and responding to what you're feeling.
And this is one thing that I always talk to families that I'm working with or women that I'm working with saying, if you just do one thing throughout pregnancy, it's just start to listen to your body because think how little in day to day life, particularly as mothers or anybody with a job, like how little we listen to our bodies.
Like you go, oh, I need a wee, well, I can't go for a wee now because of a million reasons why I can't go for a wee, or I need to lay down and rest, or I'm hungry.
And our body is very good at telling us, you're tired, you're hungry, you need a drink, you need a wee.
And pretty much 99% of the time, we go, shh, body, no, no, no, no, I'm not listening to you.
I know better.
And we completely override these needs.
And we're so used to ignoring it, that actually just taking that time, ideally before pregnancy, but certainly during pregnancy, to put yourself and your body first and start really listening to it.
Then you start to begin to see just how easy it is to trust your body to tell you what to do, which for birth is essential.
Yeah, well, I mean, I would like you, I always say, listen, listen is the key, but it's, you know, when you think that the pain or discomfort, if you want to use that word, is the body talking to you, right?
So when you feel something, it's a communication between your heart or your head and your body.
And so, yeah, just like that, if you're tuning in, I always think it kind of tells you to move a bit or move in a different way or, you know, or go and do and go to the toilet or whatever it might be, or, you know, rest your leg because you've hurt your ankle or something like that.
But I also see it in labor as it's this kind of sensation with a purpose.
You know, generally you're feeling discomfort.
So you want to move a little bit.
You want to find that rhythm.
You want to try something different, maybe try a different position.
It's probably the same, you know, in sex as well.
You know, if it's not too comfy, you try something different.
You move into a different position.
So I just think there's this connection with movement and it doesn't have to be set things either.
I'm really, you know, I know going to a class can be really daunting.
I know, especially following, you know, COVID in the last couple of years, you don't want to necessarily always go out all the time.
So just being able to dance in the kitchen or just sway your hips or just, you know, make some figure of eights or circles, anything just to get you in tune with the body to release a little bit of energy.
Because we are, we're just channels.
There's lots of energy channels in the body, you know, that you'll have blockages, you'll have imbalances, you know, you feel good.
No one ever goes, oh, I feel, oh, I didn't feel good coming back from that yoga class session.
Nobody is, you know, so probably a big favorite meme.
Going to an exercise class, you always feel good.
You always, you know, you feel uplifted.
So yeah, just anything to move, to listen in, to tune, tune in.
And I think that the key message is that you cannot do that for the first time in labor.
You can't go, oh, okay, well, when I'm in labor, I will, I'll listen to my body.
Because if you've never listened to it, you're not gonna be able to hear it properly.
And it's practice.
I mean, it's yoga practice.
You know, there's so many things you learn all the time.
It's, you know, it's breathing practice.
It's hypnobirthing track practice.
You've got to do it more than once and you cannot.
I mean, that taps into the mind element.
You know, your subconscious will call bullshit.
You know, your subconscious will go, meh, I don't think, no, you don't really believe that, do you?
You don't really believe you're gonna have a water birth.
No, it's not gonna happen.
And until you really start to embody it and really believe it in yourself and really listen and ask yourself the question, why, why do I want this?
Why does it feel good for me?
I think it does become that kind of, well, you can't do it on the day, love.
You can't just rock up and be expected to be like, oh, I'll try a bit of downward dog to shift the baby.
It doesn't work like that.
Yeah, you've gotta put the time in.
It takes work.
And this is what we're kind of miss-sold about pregnancy, I think.
You have it all, you'll just be pregnant, then you'll be fine, you'll have a baby.
But no, it's so much deeper than that.
So much kind of unpacking, unraveling, unfurling of past thoughts and past experiences before you can actually come into your labor, I think.
So there's probably people listening to this who are pregnant going, Oh my God, I haven't done any of this.
What am I gonna do?
So for somebody who is at the very kind of beginning of their birth preparation, what do you think kind of taking it right back to basics?
What should they be asking themselves?
Well, first of all, I'd just say sit down quietly with a cup of tea.
And I just say, just tune into your body, just breathe, just notice how you're breathing.
Really on a base level, just stop.
Whatever it is you're doing and give yourself a few moments to really honor what's happening.
You're growing life, okay?
This isn't just something you're doing overnight.
You're creating wonderful and tiny human, unwatched, undisturbed, all within you.
For that in itself is magic.
So sit with babies, sit with yourself and then just start questioning why.
What is it or why is it that I don't know X and Y or what do I want to know?
Or what do I want to learn about?
Could I learn some more about X, Y and Z?
What do I really know about water birth?
What does it really mean to be in hospital?
There's so much, we kind of just have this idea that we're just, oh, we'll just flow with it.
We'll just see where it takes us.
And really that can be really dangerous, I think.
And so, you know, this is your birth.
This is your experience.
You're gonna live through it.
You're gonna live with it for the rest of your life.
And it really shouldn't be taken lightly.
And that's not to scare anyone.
That is just truly what I feel it is.
It is the biggest journey you'll ever go on and probably the most important one as well.
And something quite funny actually that came up the other day.
I had my mom round for coffee the other day and she doesn't live near it.
She actually lives near you in Dorset.
She was out visiting me.
And she had bumped into like a parent of somebody that I went to primary school with.
And she hadn't seen them for years and years and years and was telling them what my job is now and what I do.
And so this is 30 odd years ago that they had their babies.
And literally instantly in response to this conversation, this woman that my mom knew just launched into the birth story of her first baby.
And these women are in their 60s.
So this is how important it is.
That is going, like a really vivid recollection of this moment of your life is gonna stay with you forever.
I remember my births more vividly than my wedding day.
And actually the wedding did come after, so it's not just to do with time.
It is a really, really transformative moment in your life.
So dedicating some time, preparation, energy to it, is not unrealistic and is not-
It's never gonna be wasted.
Yeah.
It's never gonna be wasted.
And actually similar to you, well, my mom was at my second birth, well, unexpectedly slightly, but she came to witness the birth of my second son, and she then had to take herself to bed because she couldn't, she just, it all came out.
30 years, like you say, kind of just needed to process it and had been holding it within that long.
You know, it is so important and it travels with you in your cells.
You know, I read somewhere recently, I don't know if you need to find the exact scientific research, Megan, but I read somewhere that the cells of your baby will remain in your body for at least, I think it is 27 years or something incredible like that.
So, and that is, you know, whether you've been pregnant and whether you've carried a baby to term or not, or you've miscarried, you will, you will have your children's cells in your body.
And I just thought that was just the most incredible thinking that it will change you on a cellular level for a long period of time.
And it's almost like you can feel it.
Like I can feel that as a mother, you can feel your children in you, can't you?
Yeah, it's a connection.
It's, I kind of call it like the invisible golden thread to my clients, we call this, because you connect with it in pregnancy.
You connect with this kind of imaginary thread.
But when baby the earth side, it's like a magnetic pull.
And then slowly, or it's like an elastic, slowly it kind of extends a little bit further.
And then maybe they come back a little bit for a bit more.
And then it goes until, you know, they're way over the distance, but it doesn't mean that they're still not connected.
It's really powerful.
It's really powerful.
And it's just incredible.
And so, yeah, and so exciting.
So if you're listening and you're pregnant and you're going into it, I'm incredibly jealous.
Well, if they can see my face, if they can see my face, I can't stop smiling when I talk about it because it's just amazing.
It is amazing.
So exciting.
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So we've kind of started to touch on the transformative nature of birth and what that can potentially feel like.
And sort of on the flip side of that, I think it's important to kind of talk a little bit about what disrupts this, that isn't everybody's experience of birth.
In fact, that's not the majority of people's experience of birth.
In the way that we give birth in modern times, we're actually missing a lot of the kind of spiritual transformative aspect, so this is the sacred aspect of what birth is.
And so should we just chat a little bit about the things that kind of come up that disrupt that?
You know what?
The one thing I've put down when you asked me about this question, I just put other people, strangers.
But do you know what?
It's not even strangers because we were just talking about our own mothers.
And actually, it starts there.
Like I am not going to say who it is, but somebody in my life, not my own mum, had two very difficult births of her children.
And the whole of their lives, told them how hard it was to give birth to them and how horrible it was to give birth to them.
And they are men, so hopefully, will still have impacted them, but not in the same way that it might a woman.
But that kind of generational trauma that we can kind of pass down in terms of birth, that is often where our shaping of what we expect birth to be very, very kind of starts from.
And then if those people are around you when you're considering preparing for your own birth experience, they potentially are still quite influential people in your life.
And sometimes we tend to think of it as a genetic thing.
Well, if it was hard for her, it will be hard for me.
So yes, it's people and it's strangers, but it's also people that are potentially very close and important to us.
And it's really hard, isn't it, because, you know, your family are your family, but it's all about the stories that we share, right?
Life is about the stories.
So, you know, if your, you know, your connection was hearing that message, that stays with them, as you said, but then may, if they were, let's say, female, would have then been passed down possibly to their children.
So it's kind of, if you can do all the stuff before, you can listen in and you can tune in and you really know what you want, then takes a lot of courage to then stick with it.
Because I remember with my first born, I didn't really want to go to the hospital.
I knew that that was a definite, but I wasn't at the time brave enough for a home birth.
I didn't, I kind of, I met with the team and I was a little bit further away.
And so eventually I compromised with a midwife led unit.
But nature had other plans.
And deep down, I knew I really wanted a home birth, but my husband perhaps was a bit worried and my parents were a little bit like, oh, well, we didn't have one of those.
But my grandmother had her last child at home and she passed just a year before I had my first born.
And I just kind of thought, I can do this.
The last sort of message was just let gravity help you.
That was the kind of message I kind of carried with me.
And then yeah, the birth happened very quickly.
I knew I didn't want to go to hospitals.
So baby came in the living room really fast.
But it's, I had to really just go with it at that point.
But I also had to try and stand up second time to be like, no, I'm doing it at home.
I can't get to hospital in time.
This is what I want.
It's my body, my birth.
You don't have to deal with it.
It's for me.
And you have to kind of, you're kind of breaking the generational trauma.
You're breaking that lineage and going, no, I'm going to go a different route.
I'm actually going to do this because it's my story to tell.
It's my life to lead.
And I've read or you may have read or heard or whatever.
So you're making informed decisions to continue on the pathway that's right for you.
But it takes, yeah, it takes guts.
It takes a bit of bravery and confidence.
But my thing is that if you are doing it for you, then that's your truth.
That's your kind of path to go down.
Yeah, and you're right.
It is really hard.
And the sort of what I call that it's the other people, but it's the books that you potentially choose to read, social media, friends, family, what we see on the TV.
I just tend to collectively call it the noise.
It's the noise.
It's not coming from you and what you know.
It's the like the buzz of noise around you that is kind of just drip feeding you and making you question yourself.
Yeah, all the time.
It's always been there.
That have an opinion about absolutely everything.
And what we're talking about isn't this is not how most people prepare for birth.
Most people stick their fingers in their ears, go, the baby's going to come out in one way or another, which it will.
But how do we quiet that noise?
And how do you?
But how empowering to know that you can possibly choose a different route for a start.
Like, I think we get kind of sucked into this conveyor belt.
This is how it's happening.
But what if you could choose a different way or control a few elements of things that perhaps don't sit well with you?
I think that element of having that power is quite liberating.
But with the noise, it's so hard.
It's so hard to quieten it.
I think it's harder for first-time mothers.
I think that's why I've really found that within my kind of the women that I walk with, there's definitely, they're not quite braver because they've never done it before.
It's really new.
It's really uncertain.
So they kind of hold back on really their true desires.
Second-time mums, I think you've been there before you've done it.
You kind of know what's coming.
And that can be helpful and it can be really a kind of hindrance.
And again, it's going to take some work.
So, you know, all of this is really kind of delving deep into yourself, I think, to kind of quieten and, you know, really what is it that you want?
And finding ways to be really kind of diplomatic, I guess, when dealing with friends and family of, or just if you are informed, you can then let them know, you know, I have a real battle, you know, home birth women are only 2.8% of the population.
And I'm like, where are you ladies?
We need to be telling people there is another way, not because we want to brag, but because the narrative is so strong on other experiences.
And it's just really hard to quieten that noise as well, quietening that noise of other people's birth experiences.
And I think over time, I don't know about you, Megan, but I've realized that I think the women that tell their own stories, a bit like your mum's friend, it's actually their way of healing themselves and protecting other people because they've experienced something.
They certainly don't want you to experience it.
And so by telling you their story, they feel they're giving you their truth.
And so it's kind of a release for them as well, that they've done something that might help you, not really realizing that it may have an alternative effect.
Yeah.
It's about being strong, I guess.
I don't know.
Have you thought that too?
Yeah.
I mean, in terms of the sharing of birth stories and birth experiences, I do really strongly feel that there is space for absolutely everybody.
And I do think that everybody should tell their birth story at least once to somebody.
Because of the way that it helps you process it, whether that's a wonderful birth story, whether that's an extremely traumatic birth story, it doesn't matter.
All of those stories and experiences are valid.
If you're thinking in terms of birth preparation, considering actually what's the narrative that I've got in my head now and what stories can I find that potentially challenge that?
And for a lot of us, it might be that the stories are that birth is very difficult, that birth is very complicated, that we need rescuing from giving birth and say actually just reading a story that's like a first-time mum that had a really straightforward birth that just worked and say there's, I don't know if you're the amazing do-er Natalie Meddings, she always, this is what she says is like, find three people that got what you want and basically just write down what did they do?
What are the common threads through all three of those births?
What decisions did they make?
What did they do?
Let's see what they do, and just do it again.
Because that's what we used to, that's what we would, when we lived in our village with women around us and people around us and you saw birth and you knew what was going on and everybody knew what was going on, it was very easy to be like, oh, this was helpful then.
Oh, okay, and this is helpful at that moment.
Oh, and I can ignore it at that moment.
And none of that is a surprise when you come to giving birth.
And there's no surprises to it.
So I think one of the big difficulties giving birth, especially for the first time or experiencing labor for the first time, is that you're questioning everything because you've never seen it.
Even when you watch a birth story, watch a birth video or something, really you're only watching the point where the baby comes out.
So that's the bit we all think of as birth.
That's a relatively, a very, very short part of what labor and birth actually is.
And the vast, vast majority of birth is never shown.
You'd never watch a full length labor and birth unless you're there as a midwife or a doula.
And even as a midwife and a doula, you're still not seeing the early bit of it.
So it's about asking those questions and seeing who can you ask, who can you seek that reassurance from or gather that wisdom from, because there will be people.
And if there isn't anyone in your kind of immediate network, then kind of finding circles of people where actually you might be able to gather something a little bit more reassuring.
Yeah, it's so important.
And actually, funny, you mentioned that, because I was just about to say to you that I've actually been contacted by one of her women because they were looking for, I think she has a website called Tell Me A Good Birth Story, is that right?
Tell Me A Good Birth Story.
Yeah, and I was put in touch with somebody to talk about my experience of home birth.
And that is wonderful.
Like that is such a, it's so one as a woman to help another woman is so rewarding, but also to have that there is that someone kind of like a little matchmaker to get you to that point of meeting someone who has done what you would like to do sort of thing.
I think it's just such a wonderful offering.
And most kind of people like, I don't know, some pregnancy yoga teachers or me is what I'm doing.
And so if you can put, I put up below my client's positive birth stories because you wanna be able to showcase their experiences so other people can access them too.
So yeah, she's wonderful.
She does so many good things.
On that, the kind of hearing birth stories and challenging ourselves, I also think something that is helpful is that if somebody is coming at it, potentially from the kind of more holistic preparation and actually really focusing on physiological home birth or something, actually, I also think something that's very valuable in your birth preparation is looking, actually reading stories that didn't go exactly as expected and thinking, hang on, if something arose that I was then able to make the informed decision that the right thing for me to do on the day is to have a cesarean birth or be in hospital or have an induction.
Actually, how can we transfer that holistic preparation to a setting that doesn't classically make us feel super chilled out and relaxed?
I mean, this is more like a top tip I would give you, top tips to do.
So as part of my course, we talk about a labor lounge, which is, I love it.
It's about setting up somewhere at home where you feel comfortable and safe and really start that maybe for some women, it might even be preconception as a kind of little birth altar or vignette, if you're into just little window sills of ornaments, but somewhere you can go to and be and start thinking about this sort of energetically of birth.
What is it you want to call in?
What do you want to feel?
How do you want to feel?
I mean, that is the crux of it, right?
To birth positively is to feel amazing or feel that you've had control and choice along the way.
But finding a space where you can just be, think about what is around you that makes you feel good.
Is it like fairy lights, plants, if you've got a special rug or something that kind of, maybe a yoga mat, I don't know.
But you can then literally just lift it up and transfer it wherever you go.
So wherever you choose to give birth, you've literally got all these things that you've already built some kind of association with that make you feel safe, make you feel calm.
Maybe it's a special candle, maybe it's a crystal, maybe it's, yeah, like I said, just something that it means something to you, a photo if you've already had children, maybe a family photo, something that will be oxytocin-inducing, but really being able to transport that then wherever, instantly you can become in that zone, that kind of taking that holistic element.
I always tell them to wear their eye mask and their headphones, you know, so you can really be in the zone.
And then it's just remembering that you've done all the practice, you've done all the work.
And really that's over the period of time you've been practicing, you've built up so much, hopefully, confidence and trust in yourself and your body that then when the time comes, there's sort of a letting go, there's a surrendering to the process because you can do no more then.
You always have the power to change your mind, but then there is that point where you have to just go, I'm letting go here.
Yeah, I think something that's really helpful there is just the kind of concept that actually your strength and your power, it doesn't lie in your home, it doesn't lie in a pool of water, it doesn't lie in a certain way of doing things.
But actually, exactly as you've talked about, if you can do the practice during pregnancy to actually really begin to trust yourself and to really find your own strength and power that is in here inside you, then that goes with you everywhere.
And something that I often, actually we've got on our courses, one of the guided relaxations that we use is specifically about this.
But it's about that in birth, you are never ever doing anything on your own because your baby is doing it all with you.
And so that connection and like really focusing on that connection, both like the physical, popping your hand on your bump and feeling your baby and that kind of inward emotional connection, that is something that you can come back to wherever you are.
I remember going back, I was very ill when I was pregnant and had to go back to, I went back to work at like 23, 24 weeks.
And I was so worried about going back to work.
And then there was just, I had to go and do, I was training, so I had to go and do an exam or something.
And I suddenly, when I was like, oh, I don't have to go on my own.
I can take my baby with me and nobody can stop me.
And I've got this like little buddy to do it with.
Like all of that just lifted.
And I was like, I'm not scared now.
I'm not, because it's not just me.
It's like, we're a little team and we're doing it together.
And that's, however you give birth, wherever you give birth, that's something that nobody can take away because you and your baby are just one person.
I was going to say, isn't it mamatoto, I think, in Sahili, meaning mother-baby.
And I think that for me was just, that's it.
You are in it together.
The twix to you, there's the dance of labor.
You are effectively moving your body to help baby make more space or whatever it might be.
But it's so powerful to know that, yeah, you're never on your own.
And I actually use the breath as well with that.
So, you know, your breath, you can always come back to your breathing.
You can always actually really activate your parasympathetic, your soothing, your nervous system.
You can calm that down with the power of your breath.
But as you said, it's not something you can just, oh, I remember to breathe now.
It's so much more than that.
But you have to put in the time.
You have to put in the practice, you know, even if it's just, you know, when you're in the car doing road rage, at least you can try and tap into that kind of really nice long exhale.
Babies are born on the exhale, really breathe out.
But oh, I love that, Megan.
Yeah, you are never on your own.
It's so true.
So true.
Now, I think this probably goes into what we've sort of been talking about already, but probably quite a difficult question is, you know, I work with so many women and I'm sure that you do too.
And again, we definitely see this more first time that when we talk about what they want, in inverted commas, if that's what we're kind of the discussion we're having, all of the desires that come up initially in conversation, certainly in a group situation, sometimes if in front of partners, but they're kind of, it's all very surface level.
I'd like to try water, but if I need help, that's fine.
I'd like to breastfeed, but I'm not going to beat myself up if it doesn't work, which for some people, that is genuinely what they mean, and that's absolutely fine.
And then often I kind of get, I suppose you probably work quite a lot with women without necessarily kind of partners around, which might change the level of conversation.
But once I eventually kind of get a little bit deeper, what I often find is that what emerges is that that want is more than a want.
It's a deep, deep kind of physical desire for something that often we feel quite afraid to acknowledge.
And is this something you see?
Have you got any tips on how to lean into that?
How do you say and prepare for what you actually want without having to caveat yourself all the time?
So really, I'm a big fan of birth mood boards and vision boarding and with no parameters, no boundaries.
So I literally get the women to basically, what is your dream birth?
What is it?
What does it look like?
And for some, if someone asked me that question now, it probably would have been a very different answer when I was first on.
I probably am in the woods in a shed somewhere with a burning fire or whatever, but I think it's just really important when you have no inhibitions, what does it look like to you?
And what's really interesting is a lot of things that people come back to me once, I should have brought some to show you, but what really comes down is there's lots of things that make them feel, it makes me feel like this.
I want to feel like I'm calm, so they may put the water down and I really want to have the water birth actually, because on another level, maybe they're a water sign, they actually feel really connected to being in the water.
Or it just might be that they want to have certain people with them and that is a non-negotiable.
They want to have those people in the room or on the other end of the spectrum, I don't want that woman in with me because she's going to hinder the birth process.
So that can be quite extreme, but I just think it's a wonderful thing to do.
And also it's just mindfulness activity, right?
Sitting down with some magazines, taking time to just think about babies, think about birth, think about how it's making you feel, can be really emotive, can be really tough for some women as well.
I have had women who've just sort of sat there actually not sure what a dream birth looks like because they've never given themselves permission to imagine it because in their head, they're already going down for an elective cesarean, for example, but that shouldn't stop you in my mind.
If that is your decision-making route, that's fine, but still, what is your dream birth?
Still do this exercise because actually, things will come up, the things, okay, well, I really wanted some really lovely music playing, but they've never considered that perhaps for their elective c-section.
So then you can go, okay, well, on your birth plan, why don't you put the, you know, that you've made a playlist that you'd like to play that.
So it can be just a very enlightening activity, I think.
So that would be my top tip to do that in a way that's very safe, very kind of just chilled, a Saturday afternoon kind of job, wet rainy day, just find out what you do truly desire because it's a one-shot thing, right?
Yeah, you don't get a do-over.
And if you do, it's gonna take more work as well.
And that's a really creative way of kind of thinking about it, which I love.
And another thing that I think sometimes in a kind of really simplistic way, if there is some, if you're listening now and you're thinking, oh yeah, that's me, I really want blah, but I've never told anybody, or I sort of mentioned it and it wasn't that well received.
So I've sort of quashed that deep inside myself.
Just write it down in a note on your phone now.
Don't have to tell anybody, you don't have to show anybody.
Write it down, right?
I want whatever it is that you want.
And that might be, I want a water birth.
That might be, I want an elective caesarean and everybody's trying to make me have a home birth or whatever it is.
Just write it down, just leave it there.
Leave it there for a few days, go back, look at it.
And what you'll find is because it's written down, it's now true.
You've done it, you've said it.
And then at some point in the future, you may then feel like actually the courage is coming more easily to raise that conversation, to do more research around it.
And sometimes that's just a helpful way to do it.
If you're, I was, so me and my husband, this is honestly, people will think we don't talk to each other.
Whenever we want to have like a really serious conversation, particularly when you've got kids at home, it's always really hard.
He also works in the evenings, I should point out.
So we usually just text each other or email each other.
And what that means is that each person can say everything that they want to say without being interrupted.
And you can then respond to it or the other person can respond to it when they have the head space to come at it.
So if you're sitting down and watching TV and you're saying to your partner, oh, do you know what?
I actually really want an elective cesarean.
Oh, do you know what?
I actually really want a home birth.
And they're not expecting to be told this information.
What you get in return is the snap response and not a considered response because they haven't been given the opportunity to actually consider what it is you're asking.
So, just kind of elongating the conversation, I don't know, is potentially a way of managing.
I love that.
It could have saved a few marriages there.
And just going on that with the writing down, this is just a cool little fun fact, but if you actually write with handwriting, I know obviously it's not always possible with all that length of time, but if you actually write it with your hand, you're actually connecting into your heart.
So if you're somebody who feels really disconnected, you have a wonderful vein that runs all the way into the heart chakra.
And I would say that's a really lovely thing to do.
So if you haven't got a pregnancy journal or a lovely notebook, I suggest you go and get one because you can do lots of good with, like as you say, writing things and just drawing or doodling, or if you spot an affirmation or a little quote that kind of brings you a bit of joy, just yeah, pop it down.
Okay, do that, do it.
Go and get a pen and write it down instead.
Don't write it down in real life.
Okay, so the final thing then, I suppose, I think something that is missing for a lot of women in birth in the 21st century is that sense of power or ownership over their bodies, their babies, their births, their experiences.
Sometimes it feels like we're kind of shifting the responsibility onto everybody else, the midwives, the doctors, the partner, actually giving them kind of an equal say in what's happening to our bodies.
We're so used to considering everyone else all the time that taking back that power is hard.
And we've chatted already that for a lot of us, this takes, it's not six months of birth preparation or wherever you're at, three weeks of birth preparation.
It can take years and years to reach that level of kind of autonomy, but pregnancy is often where it starts.
How do you find that this impacts women as they move forward into motherhood, womanhood, like the rest of life?
Oh, so big, isn't it?
Such a big question.
So how it affects motherhood and children, I think as well, like the next generation.
I've seen it kind of from a primary school teacher's perspective as well in the classroom with the children.
You know, birth impacts greatly.
And in the early days of motherhood and when you're in throes of caring for another human being and you've never done it before, the power is essential.
The confidence in yourself is essential.
The kind of releasing of self-doubt needs to kind of be worked through and you need people around you to support you in that.
This isn't something you can do on your own.
Certainly in my experience, you know, I've tried to create a community for that very reason.
It's why I started the business when all pregnancy services were cut, you know, I really suddenly had this awakening of like, well, where are they going to go?
Who are they going to talk to?
Where do they find support?
You know, it was a real light bulb moment or just to realize that actually this is more important than I think we're giving it credit for, you know, even today, you're hearing of home birth services being cut because of, you know, staff numbers.
And, you know, it's just, it's just being aware that you just need support.
You need people to help you.
You need someone to come around and cook you some meals.
You need someone to just drop off some milk, whatever it might be, because your experience of those early days, following the birth, you're healing, you know, birth is a trauma.
However, you've birthed, let's just remember, it's a physical trauma on the body.
And then if you suffered birth trauma on top of that, then you're kind of twofold already.
And then dealing with a newborn through matressence and into the fourth trimester, whack on another kind of experience of feelings.
I mean, it's heavy, right?
It's one of those things that is so overlooked is that we so just talk about, we just talk about birth, like birth, birth, birth, just this one thing that happens.
And what we've hopefully revealed through all of this chat is that it's not that it's our life leads to the, the conception of the baby, which leads through the pregnancy, which influences the birth, which influences that early postnatal period, which then like really influences like parenting forever.
And you're going to be a parent forever.
Literally until you die, you will be a parent now, which is like a heavy responsibility.
Sorry to throw it out at the end of the podcast.
But I do think that when you find that power in, I definitely think that for me, it was sort of bubbling throughout my life, but going through pregnancy, having a baby was, it just certainly gave me permission to actually like, I don't care now, this is it.
This is what's important to me.
And that power, you know, it influences the childcare decisions you make for your children, the education decisions you make for your children, like what they watch on TV, like everything is influenced by how strong you're feeling in yourself.
And it's like, the birth is kind of just, I mean, the pregnancy is the start, right?
All that change, then the birth happens.
And for me, it was just sort of this feeling of opening, of like that awakening sense of, oh my gosh, this is, I'm here now.
This is what I'm doing.
I'm a mother and I felt it really to be like a homecoming.
It was suddenly like a deep kind of like, Mexico, they believe you travel to the stars, collect the souls of your baby and then you travel back to earth.
And I truly believe that that's some element of coming back with a thud and realizing that this is it.
But then that freedom, like you said, that liberating feeling of just like, yeah, and I'm gonna do it my way because, well, who else am I gonna follow actually?
I wanna do it my way.
And you kind of have to take ownership of what it means to you to be a mother and it will look different for everybody.
And that's the beauty of it, right?
We can all be our own mothers and we're mothering the best way that's right for our children.
And that's also very freeing.
You can definitely look, I think it's really important to find women to look up to or to see how they handle it or perhaps different situations.
I think we have so much to learn from other mothers around us.
But it's really important to be aware that how you're feeling directly impacts your baby and directly impacts your experience of those early days of motherhood.
So if you can prepare and then have the birth of your dreams and then kind of come into motherhood, it might not all kind of travel that way.
It may not all be really positive and some bits are really tricky, but there is an awareness in yourself to be able to check in and awareness of how you're truly feeling.
And then how to ask for help, I think is also really, really powerful to be able to ask for support.
And I think hopefully a reassuring space to end on is that you can find this at any time.
My parents have just, my mom's retired, they've moved down to Dorset, they've done this, they're doing this big house renovation.
And it's like, God, yeah, do you know what?
They've done it, they finally put themselves first and done what is right for them in that moment.
And actually, so even if you're listening to this and you haven't had that, it didn't start in pregnancy or it didn't happen in birth or even the kind of early postnatal period, there is always time to actually go, I'm gonna put myself first, I'm going to think about my body and my mind and my heart and all of it and actually find a space where I start to feel confident and content.
And I think that you just touched on something really, really beautiful about that self care.
And I would urge anyone listening, tonight run yourself a bath, take some time out, just try and incorporate some kind of ritual that's for you, some kind of habit that doesn't involve anybody else and isn't for anybody else.
Because I think as you travel through the process of pregnancy, you're thinking about the baby, you're thinking about partners and family and then the baby's here and it still keeps going.
But really the mother is key.
The mother, if she is functioning at her optimum, everyone else will be fine.
And we're sort of really sort of slow, I think in our culture to recognize that, that this maternal figure that we see really is the one that needs to be nourished from the get-go, from the very initial days so that she can look after her family and be part of a community that is functioning.
Never too late, even in the birth preparation.
I never say, even if you find you're like nine months, and you're due next week, there is still time.
Just pick up a book, take some practice, do some breathing.
It really is just check in with your body and tune in.
Yeah, amazing.
Now, I'm gonna throw a question at you that I realize I didn't send you in advance, but it's the question that we ask at the end of every podcast is, if you could gift a pregnant or birthing mother or person one thing, what would you give them?
I would always give them courage.
Courage that you know best, courage that you can do it, courage to trust yourself.
That's all you need.
Just the kind of belief in yourself that you can do it, and you've got it.
Amazing.
Ah, a really good message, hopefully to be sending people off into the rest of their days or evenings with.
Thank you so much for joining me.
That was wonderful and affirming and lovely.
Oh, thanks so much for having me again.
It's so nice to talk to you.
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